1Peter Wilson  4/7/2009 11:04:52 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Please bring us into the 21st century and support this

Pete

2SouthPaw  4/7/2009 11:19:08 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

I would have notes windows support ICO files.

{ Link })

With support for Windows Vista icon files we could include 16x16 through 256×256 with 4-, 8-, 16-, 24- or 32-bit colour depth. Then the icon size could change based on a setting.

3Colin Williams  4/7/2009 11:37:33 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Grovel grovel...SERIOUSLY want this. Needs to be able to specify a separate image for the Workspace vs Bookmark vs Tab (ie, if they're specified, Notes can't just resize the icon itself).

Business case? Don't have one other than its high time that Notes icons look equally as polished for 3rd party apps as they do for the inbuilt PIM apps). Having such a limited palette and scaling for tabs detracts from all the wonderful UI work that has gone into 8/8.5.

4Richard Moy  4/8/2009 1:13:19 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

It makes the application more polished. With the 16 color icons it looks like it was built in the 90's. How about adding icons to buttons too.

5Angelo  4/8/2009 1:46:36 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

I agree with the ico support request in msg #2

Also I second the button incon request!

6Colin Williams  4/8/2009 2:04:37 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Thinking on this further; .ico files is the way to go given the huge array of icon libraries available on the internet. The fact that they support multiple sizes would suit the various places they need to be rendered (chicklets, replicator, tabs, bookmark bar, widget panels).

7Ingo Erdmann  4/8/2009 3:14:11 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

For ISVs within the IBM Business Partner community, the icon is the face to their applications.

If this looks ugly, users get a bad first impression of your solution. It just looks agy.

And the icon is in right in their face, every single day of their work life.

8Bruce Mackenzie  4/8/2009 3:25:11 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Yes, in my opinion this should have high priority.

I can understand that it is difficult to come up with a valid business case, but shouldn't usability be a reason? It's completely impossible to design an icon today that doesn't look out of place in the Notes 8 client, because everything else looks so sleek.

It's especially irritating when a composite application (with a nice PNG icon) opens a normal Notes document, which is then stuck with the old ugly icon.

- Bruce

9Ed Maloney  4/8/2009 4:12:18 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Either allow an alternate image format as the database icon, or provide an updated library of icons in the current format. As already mentioned the existing icons do not create a good first impression.

10Karsten Lehmann  4/8/2009 4:40:01 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Yes, please add support for high-colored database icons. The "business-value" of those icons is the same as your update to the 255 predefined icons. If the apps don't look 21st century, it creates a bad impression for the user.

Please also add PNG support for images resources including alpha channel.

11Richard Shergold  4/8/2009 4:54:38 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Yes Please !

12Stuart McIntyre  4/8/2009 6:08:27 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Always good to hear you requesting feedback Mary Beth.

However, I'm slightly shocked that we really need to be giving you "cogent explanations of business value" for something that we have all been asking for "many years".

Has it really come to the point where the bean counters rule over what matters to the ISV and "situational developers" in Notes customers?

13Wayne Sobers  4/8/2009 6:48:31 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

How about acceptance as a business value? The *look* is the first impression end users have, and has a big influence on how they view the rest of the application. In smaller companies end users have a much bigger say in which apps they use. IT in these organizations tend to be caretakers rather than direction makers and it's far more important to keep the individual high level producers happy (no matter how much firefighting IT does behind the scenes).

It may not be fair, but end users are more forgiving of an applications short comings if it looks good.

From a competitive stance, the small business tools in use today also look better - and that's one of the key methods to just get the consumer to even try the product.

14marie scott  4/8/2009 7:08:31 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Yes! This would be a great option!

15Carl Tyler  4/8/2009 8:02:45 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

I'm in agreement with @12.

You guys realise that people also want to see an updated and modern workspace?

16Karl-Henry Martinsson  4/8/2009 11:24:40 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Very high on my list, as I been telling you for the last 3 (4?) years at Lotusphere...

The best business case: If people think the applications are slick and look good, they think it is a good product. An ugly icon equals an old/outdated/bad product. Will be harder to sell to a customer.

Perhaps they decide that Outlook or something written in VB.net looks more polished and slick, and thus work better.

To most users, a good looking application "works good", while and ugly one "is probably buggy and bad".

How hard can it be? You and I already talked 3 years ago about how to solve backwards compatibility on the database icons:

*Create a nice new icon editor that support both the old icon format as well as the new one. I am sure Eclipse contain something like this already.

* Store the highres/high-color icon/PNG/JPG in a separate place in the database.

* Old clients will render todays icon.

* New clients will first look for the new icon, if it is blank or does not exists, use the old icon.

17Kevin Pettitt  4/8/2009 11:25:54 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

The 16-color DB Icon a seriously embarrassing limitation that takes all the steam out of a conversation about how "modern" Notes is now. From the standpoint of trying to convince folks who long ago concluded that Notes is legacy 1990s software, showing essentially the same old workspace full of crap icons is killer (and not in a good way). Better graphic support throughout is important, but the db/app icons are currently a huge lost opportunity to make a brilliant "first" impression on such folks (to say nothing of fodder for criticism from MS).

We shouldn't have to apologize for anything about the product, and lingering things like db icons, the dated workspace (I love the workspace, but it's too rigid for 2009), the flaky replicator page, and various 64KB limits hinder my willingness to reintroduce Notes to those who have written it off. I fear losing them for another 5 years if they notice the key things like this that *haven't* changed in the last 15.

Oh, and we haven't even talked about the impression this "feature" makes on new developers, who probably see how limited their icon choices are and wonder if this is a platform they should invest time in.

18John Vaughan  4/8/2009 11:46:50 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Business case? Seriously? Isn't the fact that those 16 bit icons look like crap no matter how hard you try and Photoshop them enough?

Why would Lotus want Notes to look so awful, after all the work they've put into it to make it look great?

Agreed about the .ico support, that would be great. Giving us image resources would be a huge step forward.

Agreed to about the icon being the first entrance point to the application. This doesn't just apply to third party apps, it certainly applies to internal apps as well. Remember we are all constantly selling Notes, internally as well as externally. To the end user a nice looking icon is as important as all that crazy workflow programmed in the back end that they never "see".

19Concerned Domino Admin  4/8/2009 2:03:34 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

I agree with @12 and @15 and @17.

This has been raised again and again and it's bordering on an insult asking people to vote for it.

Due to my position I'm unable to leave my real name but can contact you via e-mail if you like.

20Peter Presnell  4/8/2009 2:52:14 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

The question I would ask is how much of an effort would it be to make such a change? I could think of a dozen or so features I would be more interested (as a developer) seeing added to Notes Designer (e.g. LS Class Editor, XPages for Notes Client), but my perception is that improving the database design options is more than likely a lot less effort. @12 @17 make very good points.

21Darren  4/8/2009 4:00:50 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Basically echo what's said in @17. It seems a shame that the UI team have done so much excellent work over the past couple of years, yet we end up stuck with ugly badly-rendered small icons on tabs which spoil the overall polish. The only escape from that is an image resource defined within a composite application.

However, in defence of the question, development have to weigh up the time and dollars spent against business impact. It's right to be looking at prioritisation now... and no-one can complain about not being consulted. We should all applaud this open approach where you get to comment.

22Jan Schulz  4/9/2009 2:43:38 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

+1 @12 and @17...

23Eric Mack  4/9/2009 2:50:13 AM  The present icons in Notes represent a major opportunity to improve customer perception

Mary Beth,

Many have said what I would say.

While Notes is an outstanding product and the design team has done an amazing job with it. The icon is the first impression that a user has about Notes. It sets the stage for his expectations and opinion about the product.

Thank you for asking.

Eric

24Benoit Dubuc  4/9/2009 4:38:38 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

In my area (Montreal, Canada), Notes is mostly seen as a legacy system, and I am pretty sure it has to do with the workspace and database icons (not only that, but off topic).

As Erick just mentioned, first impressions are very important (to users and developers as well), and a Windows 3.1 icon just doesn't do it.

I agree that .ico files should be supported, but if not possible, at least let us have an icon editor that supports more than 16 colors. I have a freeware to edit icons that is fairly small in size (about 2.5 MB) so I'm sure adding this to Designer should not be a huge thing.

With all the nice icons available these days, it would really help us to show that Notes isn't legacy, especially with xpages and lovely icons. It might "force" developers to build nice looking apps too, which is another issue I have seen too many times (poorly designed UI).

Benoit

25Max Verbong  4/9/2009 7:14:49 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

I only have one question... could it please be in 8.5.1?

26Alex Karonski  4/9/2009 7:47:58 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Isn't this "improvement" a little too late? :)

This should be done years ago.

27Errol  4/9/2009 8:54:18 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Similar to #12 and #17, not having updated icons lends to the thought the Notes/Domino is a legacy platform. While my company is enjoying the benefits of several workflow applications, its pulling teeth to have my new developers write anything in a "legacy" system. Plus, we have a number of databases that have the same icons because its a "pain" to create our own. Using standard icon files for Vista, as an example, to take away some of the legacy look and "jazz up" older Notes applications. My 5 cents!

28Tripp Black  4/9/2009 9:05:13 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Yes, please add support as @12 and @17 indicated. It is really awesome that old is new.

As for how to spice up workspace, just look at iTunes. The new cutting edge is the Notes workspace, only it's workspace has much cooler icons.

(Oh, and the blinking icons in workspace is annoying w/Standard client. Sorry it was doing that again yesterday and it's fresh.)

29Henning Heinz  4/9/2009 9:26:59 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Without an updated Notes Workspace this would not change much for me.Ah yes, that good old workspace again. Hate it but cannot live without it.

30Brian  4/9/2009 3:17:40 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Apple's iPhone has a workspace too. :) Of course, their icons look much better!

31Christian Tillmanns  4/10/2009 2:58:56 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Who do I have to bribe with swiss chocolate? Yes, please more possibilities for icons.

32Bastian Wieczorek  4/10/2009 4:53:35 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

I agree with @7 and @17 and @23.

The community is requesting this since many years... Its a pain to build a good looking icon with the build in icon editor. And the workspace isn´t deat ;-).

I would vote for this.

33Mike McP  4/10/2009 10:32:52 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

16-color icons are embarrassing. Like others have said, no matter how good the app, you're instantly fighting up-hill after the users see that lovely 16-color icon.

34Tinus Riyanto  4/12/2009 10:42:02 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as database (application) icons?

I am confused, Mary Beth said something about specifying an image resorce as database icon while the idea jam link only said adding .png and.svg to image resources, no mention about database icon whatsoever.

Perhaps the idea jam link is wrong ?

35kamal  4/13/2009 10:31:16 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Support this issue.

As other have said this should have been done 6-7 years back.

I do agree that most businesses look at Lotus Notes as a legacy application which did not follow the technology curve.

36Mat Newman  4/13/2009 10:56:14 PM  I want it bad!

Business Case:

SameTime, Connections, etc - ie: other Lotus Applications - support the use of "Profile" images to identify people and (in the case of connections) organisations.

Other applications use icons (through images) to identify the application or contact. Twitter, facebook, iThing, etc.

With the inclusion of icons beyond what has been the Notes standard since forever, applications will be more easily recognisable due to the enhanced (read slick) looking images that would then be available throughout the Notes client.

Extending this to mail, users should be able to either use their SameTime image, or an image they choose to represent their own database (put it in preferences on the same tab as "Signature").

This would please the many users I am aware of that previously went to the extent of customising their bookmark bars to include images for the Mail and Calendars they access and manage on a daily basis, and since the ability to customise the bookmark bar was regressed in 8 (standard), this feature would be a welcome enhancement.

Finally, with the inclusion of a less restricted icon - whether it be bmp, gif, jpg, png, or ico - applications would be more easily identifiable due to the tiny nuances in colour that could be applied to differentiate individual applications within a suite, which is not currently possible with the 16 colour palette.

37Neil Wainwright  4/16/2009 11:15:24 PM  Not done yet?

Hi Mary Beth,

It's funny that this hasn't been done yet. If he ran the shop, Steve Jobs would've fired all the devs that didn't fix this years ago, right after he fired the product management team. Yes, Tim Cook would do the same. It just makes Notes apps look like crap. It's hard to justify buying crap. :)

OK, I'm being overly dramatic but geez, this is the new millennium. It's not the days of Windows 95 and Windows 3.1. Justify it? Is everyone at IBM (well, at least those with decision-making authority) that myopic and visually-challenged?

...Neil

38Steven Elwell  8/25/2009 12:39:59 PM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

A picture is worth a thousand words.

39Andrew Brew  10/13/2009 1:40:07 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

I was shocked to find that this was *not* in 8.5.1. What everybody else said - limiting icons to 16 colours just makes the product give a really old, tired, first impression, which is such a shame with all the other improvements that have been made.

40Marcie K. Vantrease  11/20/2009 11:14:06 AM  so just how badly do you want image resources as databse (application) icons?

Yes, Please let us have updated icons. Nothing sells the end user better than the bells and whistles. Lotus Notes is worth a 1000 words but, the Workspace icons have not kept up with the rest of Lotus Notes. Please, please, please let us get updated.